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  • #31
    Not that I'm sold(I do sell 50 tons of Motul every year), but, I checked with my friend who is an engineer at the Motul factory in France, and submitted all the facts I read here, and he recommended a 5w40 grade.
    So you might give a try to the Motul 8100 5w40 X-cess for street use.
    In the racecar I use the 300V 15w50 , but it's not a long life oil, , but I know people that uses it in E46 M3 without any problems.

    Drevaen

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    • #32
      Would Castrol 10w-60 (the oil spec'ed for E46 M3's and other recent high-perf BMW's) be a suitable oil for our cars?

      It certainly seems as if Redline is regarded as a good solution by everyone.
      -AJ

      -'88 Henna Red-

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by sacM3 View Post
        I have a 5 qt of M1 “gold cap” 15/50 that is SM but also have a 1 qt M1 “gold cap” that was purchased after the jug as a top off and it’s SL. So an older formulation. With higher ZDDP or the same?
        The present M1 15w-50 formulation contains 1200ppm ZDDP, so there isn't anything apparent from this figure that indicates reformulation. Again, I haven't seen anything that suggests the SM mandated reformulation affects much outside the regular 20 and 30 weight consumer grades.


        Originally posted by sacM3 View Post
        I also had a qt of BMW 5-30 synthetic (Castrol) left over from changing the oil the wife’s X3 and it is SL as well. So I guess (if I read some of the websites above correctly), the SL should have higher concentration in the lower weights and it would seem that BMW is sticking with this? Or do I just have old stock from the dealer?
        I'd say more likely the latter. I suspect that the SM specs will be evident in every major brand's 20 and 30 weight flagship offerings. But then again, the reduced ZDDP isn't supposed to be an issue except to the relatively small percentage of vehicles that have lubrication needs that fall outside of the norm.


        - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - AUTOMERGED! There's no thread "bumping" or "double posting" within a 24hr period. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


        Originally posted by Low Level View Post
        Would Castrol 10w-60 (the oil spec'ed for E46 M3's and other recent high-perf BMW's) be a suitable oil for our cars?

        It certainly seems as if Redline is regarded as a good solution by everyone.
        I don't see that grade listed on Castrol's site. Is that packaged specifically for BMW?

        As for Castrol's Syntec grades, the only ones that remain listed as "SL" are the 0w-30 and 5w-40. I can't verify what this actually means.

        I didn't see much in the way of published specifics for Redline oils where ZDDP is concerned.
        Last edited by Ted B; 02-05-2008, 04:58 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
        2003 Mitsu EVO VIII - 2.0L / 600+whp
        1988 BMW M3 turbo - Work in progress. . .
        1986 SVO Mustang - Work in progress. . .

        Comment


        • #34
          Castrol 10w-60 can be found on Turner's website:

          http://www.turnermotorsport.com/html...ID=07510009420

          It is the factory's recommended oil for the last few M cars (starting with the E39).

          Is this a possible choice for our E30 M3's, too?


          Regarding Redline, Dougy Fresh's post at the bottom of Page 1 of this thread has a reply from Redline on the topic.


          Also, what do you think about Royal Purple's response?
          -AJ

          -'88 Henna Red-

          Comment


          • #35
            I just heard back from castrol:

            Thank You For Contacting Castrol North America,

            Castrol is aware of articles in enthusiast magazines and web-sites, as
            well as after-market parts manufacturer discussions concerning GF-4 engine
            oils and cam-shaft durability issues in older performance vehicles. Some
            consumers suspect the lower level of ZDDP in GF-4 oils may be causing
            these failures. Castrol is currently investigating this issue.

            For those consumers that wish not to use a GF-4 oil in these vehicles,
            Castrol does offer the following products that contain Zinc at a level
            that is typical of the Zinc level found in oils (API SG) marketed during the
            "muscle car" era of time:

            The following Castrol products have Zinc levels that are typical of API
            SG oil:

            1. Castrol Syntec 20W-50 Has a minimum of 1200ppm zddp (*NEWLY
            FORMULATED classic oil formula - see link to website below for information on our new 20W-50 product)
            2. Castrol SYNTEC 5W-40
            3. Castrol Grand Prix 4T 10W-40 (product has been replaced by Castrol
            Motorcycle 4T 10W-40)
            4. Castrol Grand Prix 4T 20W-50 (product has been replaced by Castrol
            Motorcycle 4T 20W-50)
            5. Castrol GO! ATV 10W-40
            6. Castrol GO! ATV 20W-50
            7. Castrol TWS Motorsport 10W-60 (full synthetic, available @ BMW
            dealerships)
            8. BMW Long Life 5W-30 (full synthetic, available @ BMW dealerships)
            9. Castrol GO! 10W-40 Motorcycle Oil
            10. Castrol GO! 20W-50 Motorcycle Oil

            http://www.castrol.com/castrol/gener...915470&content

            Comment


            • #36
              Regarding Castrol 10w-60 I cannot say that I would recommend a 60 weight oil for our application. What the S14 engines were designed to use is much different than the newer M engines.

              I agree with RP's response in that ZDDP content is a basis for eliminating potentially unsuitable oils (e.g. "SM"), but it is only one aspect of an oil, and therefore an oil with slightly more ZDDP cannot be regarded as being 'better' based upon that alone.

              So far, the better (where ZDDP is concerned), most convenient selections for U.S. residents seem to be:

              Valvoline Racing Synthetic 20w-50
              Mobil 1 15w-50
              Royal Purple 15w-40 or 20w-50
              Castrol 'New Formulation' Syntec 20w-50 (see post above)
              Redline 10w-40 or 15w-50
              *Possibly* Shell Rotella T Synthetic 5w-40 (SL Rating)
              *Possibly* Amsoil "Premium Protection" label synthetic in 10w-40 and 20w-50 (SL Ratings)

              All of these products feature (to the best that I can tell) ~1200ppm ZDDP, which appears to be more or less an industry standard for products where higher ZDDP is desired.

              I hope this helps clarify things in the big picture.
              Last edited by Ted B; 02-05-2008, 05:55 AM.
              2003 Mitsu EVO VIII - 2.0L / 600+whp
              1988 BMW M3 turbo - Work in progress. . .
              1986 SVO Mustang - Work in progress. . .

              Comment


              • #37
                That's a good list. Might try Redline 10w-40 myself.

                Still wondering why the sudden issue w/ Mobil1 15w-50, if it's still supposed to have the right level of ZDDP... ?

                I don't have a factory book handy - what was the recommended oil for our cars, back in the day?
                -AJ

                -'88 Henna Red-

                Comment


                • #38
                  I think the sudden fear concerning Mobil 1 was justified with the lighter grades that are used (without concern) by 95+% of consumer autos. But we shouldn't be using those anyway, regardless of the ZDDP content.

                  IIRC, our cars were originally specified to use 10w-30 (someone pls check that). That was dino oil, and I typically move up a weight by default when switching from an originally specified dino viscosity to a full synthetic.

                  I posted this before, but Mobil's ZDDP content for all their oils is listed here:

                  http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...duct_Guide.pdf
                  Last edited by Ted B; 02-05-2008, 06:06 AM.
                  2003 Mitsu EVO VIII - 2.0L / 600+whp
                  1988 BMW M3 turbo - Work in progress. . .
                  1986 SVO Mustang - Work in progress. . .

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Low Level View Post
                    That's a good list. Might try Redline 10w-40 myself.

                    Still wondering why the sudden issue w/ Mobil1 15w-50, if it's still supposed to have the right level of ZDDP... ?

                    I don't have a factory book handy - what was the recommended oil for our cars, back in the day?

                    :attention: In the Owners Mannual... they recommend using 15-50. I'll double check. But my mechanic recommended 20-50 since I 1st got my car.

                    This is what i've been using... http://www.castrol.com/castrol/gener...tentId=7032644
                    Last edited by Robert; 02-05-2008, 01:11 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      15w-40 winter and 20w-50 summer if I remember correctly.

                      88 M3 - LACHSSILBER/M TECH
                      89 M3 - ALPINEWEISS II/SCHWARZ
                      85 323I S52 - ALPINEWEISS/SCHWARZ
                      91 M TECHNIC TURBO - MACAOBLAU/M TECH


                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Thanks for the info.
                        Will switch to:
                        Castrol SYNTEC 20w-50

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Well it seems that after a reinvestigation that Mobil 1 Synthetic 15w-50, both new and old blends are ok for use as far as ZDDP are concerned.

                          So do we consider this myth busted?

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            I've been running Motul 300v 15W-50 but can't tell any results, because haven't tried with anything else. My choise was purely based on the correct viscosity and the fact that this is about the only fully esther based oil with a reasonable price (on par with TSW).

                            Drevaen, what did you mean with 'non longlife' ? I change mine with about 5000 km intervals.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by rvuorenr View Post
                              I've been running Motul 300v 15W-50 but can't tell any results, because haven't tried with anything else. My choise was purely based on the correct viscosity and the fact that this is about the only fully esther based oil with a reasonable price (on par with TSW).

                              Drevaen, what did you mean with 'non longlife' ? I change mine with about 5000 km intervals.

                              This oil is a motorsport oil intended for racing, so it was not tested for long life like the current oils in Europe(15000km between oil change)
                              But, I know a lot of people using it in E46 M3 since their car was new, without any problems. The main difference in this oil is the detergent additives, it has a lot of it, mainly because of fuel content in oil, commonly found in race engines(richer air/fuel mixture)

                              With oil change every 5000Km, it is as safe as any other oil, and as you said, the 300V is ester based oil. Ester is an unbreakable molecule.
                              Drevaen

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by ShiftBMW View Post
                                Well it seems that after a reinvestigation that Mobil 1 Synthetic 15w-50, both new and old blends are ok for use as far as ZDDP are concerned.

                                So do we consider this myth busted?

                                That appears to be the case.

                                It wasn't entirely untrue, it just didn't apply to all grades, nor was it restricted to a single brand. Nevertheless, it sparked an interest, and we all know more about it now. I'm glad this topic was brought up, as it eventually yielded a good deal of very useful information.
                                2003 Mitsu EVO VIII - 2.0L / 600+whp
                                1988 BMW M3 turbo - Work in progress. . .
                                1986 SVO Mustang - Work in progress. . .

                                Comment

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