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J STOCK springs are BACK!!!!!!!!!

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  • Originally posted by proctor750 View Post
    Had a buddy who is rebuilding his M3 snag a set of springs and the front dampers from ECS. We are going to attempt to go with the econoline rears revalved - will report back on how that works out.
    I'll be anxious to get your feedback on the results. Before your buddy installs the dampers if you (or he) could also post the compressed length and extended length of the rear Bilsteins (B46-1720-H1) I would appreciate it.

    Comment


    • Anyone install these on their car yet? Feedback?
      I see the H&R Race are slightly shorter, is the height difference noticeable and how do they compare vs the Race on ride quality?

      Comment


      • Originally posted by mwagner10702 View Post
        Here is an update on the Bilstein damper situation. As I mentioned in post #100, you can still get the front J-Stock strut insert from ECS. I ordered a set and they came last week. at $203 per insert it was less expensive than buying a set of B8 and having them revalved (cheapest place I found to revalve wanted $200 per shock). As for the rears I ordered a set of Bilstein 24-000642 from Bilstein UK. These are the Group N Motorsport versions with the 200/200 valving. At $271 each including FedEx International shipping they were still cheaper than buying the B46-1720-H0 shocks and having them revalved.

        Now I just need Will to come through on the springs . . .

        Click image for larger version

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        How did your setup work out with the Jstock fronts and the Group N rears?

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        • Have not installed them yet. Just recently purchased a u$ed $et of front $trut hou$ing$ (now have one kidney remaining LOL) and I want to get them bead blasted and powder coated before I install them. Since the track season is now underway I probably won't get around to installing them until this winter.

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          • S14Mpower
            S14Mpower commented
            Editing a comment
            This hobby/lifestyle is definitely rough on your wallet!
            I'm probably going the same route as you, including the install around winter!

            Thanks!

        • Anyone have the Part Number for the gland nut and bellows?

          Comment


          • Originally posted by mwagner10702 View Post

            I'll be anxious to get your feedback on the results. Before your buddy installs the dampers if you (or he) could also post the compressed length and extended length of the rear Bilsteins (B46-1720-H1) I would appreciate it.
            Collapsed 16~ expanded 22~
            Collapsed 15~ expanded 22~

            Before Sending them in.
            Attached Files

            Comment


            • Originally posted by proctor750 View Post
              Anyone have the Part Number for the gland nut and bellows?
              Assuming you are referencing parts for the front strut.

              Gland nut = 31-32-1-117-376
              Bellows = E4-B46-670

              NOTE: The gland nut part number above is not for the Bilstein strut cartridge. If you are looking for the gland nut for the B8 Sport Cartridge (51mm) it is part number B36-816 C1. I think you will need to order this direct from Bilstein. Call 704-663-7563 and ask for the small parts department.

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              • Originally posted by proctor750 View Post

                Collapsed 16~ expanded 22~
                Collapsed 15~ expanded 22~

                Before Sending them in.
                Thanks. I can confirm that those are the same length (compressed and expanded) as the Group N rear damper (24-000642).

                Comment


                • I received the springs and front shocks. Everything good there.


                  regarding the rears - I had them drop shipped to a shock service in mooresville Nc. They called today and said “we cannot re-valve these because they are “crimped”.”

                  does anyone have a recommended service to have them re-valved?Click image for larger version

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                  • Originally posted by redneckvtek View Post
                    . . . does anyone have a recommended service to have them re-valved?
                    Try Performance Shock, Inc. They are located in Sonoma Raceway @ Sears Point. They do most if not all the major race team's shocks.

                    PSI
                    29139 Arnold Drive
                    Sonoma, CA 95476
                    (800) 965-5664

                    BTW - what rears did you send to NC?

                    Mark

                    Comment


                    • If you pull off the boot you will be able to see where the valving was engraved into the top of the strut cartridge. Very cool.

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                      • Originally posted by mwagner10702 View Post

                        Try Performance Shock, Inc. They are located in Sonoma Raceway @ Sears Point. They do most if not all the major race team's shocks.

                        PSI
                        29139 Arnold Drive
                        Sonoma, CA 95476
                        (800) 965-5664

                        BTW - what rears did you send to NC?

                        Mark

                        33-017204
                        https://www.amazon.com/Bilstein-33-0.../dp/B009FU6Y0G

                        RESuspension is the company I tried.

                        Comment


                        • Update for this afternoon:

                          Apparently Bilstein has recently changed some manufacturing things. This is what I have learned from Bilstein directly:

                          - All shocks manufactured in the USA are "crimped" and therefore not rebuildable.
                          - The OE fitment E30 B8 shocks (24-020275) have recently been converted to the "crimped" design. Older shocks are likely rebuildable. The crimping started at revision H4.


                          The OE Fitment B8's (24-020275) are valved 170/60
                          The Ford Van B6's listed earlier on this page (33-017204) are valved 300/150

                          I wonder if the ford van valving is sufficient for these springs? The compression is higher by 50% and the damping is lower by 25% from what I understand is the target of 200/200?

                          I am working with bilstein and REsuspension to find an alternative shock. RE has a mustang shock that is 1" longer, not inverted, but has 1" more travel than the Ford Van (33-017204) inverted shocks. How close is the compressed length to being too long? I can possibly measure myself this weekend if no one already knows.

                          Attached Files

                          Comment


                          • I don't think the Mustang shock will work due to its length, especially with a lower spring. Probably be on the bump stop a lot.

                            The Turner J-Stock valving for the rear was 200/125. The 200/200 you reference are the Group N rates. I think the standard rates of the 33-017204 are not going to result in the best ride or handling. They are over damped on rebound and compression. While I think you could get away with the higher compression number (since it is between the J-Stock and Group N), the higher rebound number combined with the 1026lb rear spring may not play well together. Although since you have them (assuming you can;t return them) why not install them and see what the ride is like. Keep in mind the Econoline van from which these were sourced is a lot heavier in the rear than the E30 M3.

                            I see a couple of options:

                            1) Purchase the Bilstein Group N dampers (24-000642). Unfortunately they are expensive. However when you factor in the cost to re-valve the 33-017204 damper you actually come out ahead.

                            2) There is a set of original Bilstein J-Stock rears for sale on the SIG. I am going to assume you are not a member so I'll post the person's contact info here (hope he doesn't mind!) His name is Eric Heinrich. You can reach him at ericjheinrich at gmail.com, or at 617 549 7280. Per Eric they will need a rebuild, but given that they are original (and I am assuming early) Bilsteins they should not have the crimp and be able to be rebuilt.

                            Unfortunate about the changes to the 33-017204 damper.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by mwagner10702 View Post
                              I don't think the Mustang shock will work due to its length, especially with a lower spring. Probably be on the bump stop a lot.

                              The Turner J-Stock valving for the rear was 200/125. The 200/200 you reference are the Group N rates. I think the standard rates of the 33-017204 are not going to result in the best ride or handling. They are over damped on rebound and compression. While I think you could get away with the higher compression number (since it is between the J-Stock and Group N), the higher rebound number combined with the 1026lb rear spring may not play well together. Although since you have them (assuming you can;t return them) why not install them and see what the ride is like. Keep in mind the Econoline van from which these were sourced is a lot heavier in the rear than the E30 M3.

                              I see a couple of options:

                              1) Purchase the Bilstein Group N dampers (24-000642). Unfortunately they are expensive. However when you factor in the cost to re-valve the 33-017204 damper you actually come out ahead.

                              2) There is a set of original Bilstein J-Stock rears for sale on the SIG. I am going to assume you are not a member so I'll post the person's contact info here (hope he doesn't mind!) His name is Eric Heinrich. You can reach him at ericjheinrich at gmail.com, or at 617 549 7280. Per Eric they will need a rebuild, but given that they are original (and I am assuming early) Bilsteins they should not have the crimp and be able to be rebuilt.

                              Unfortunate about the changes to the 33-017204 damper.
                              Uh, rebound damping is for the rebound of the spring. This is the important one, otherwise you end up with a bouncy car. Compression damping needs to be lower, otherwise the suspension is needlessly harsh. So, if one runs stiffer compression damping at 200, and rebound at 150, you will have overly harsh compression and bouncy rebound. I tried my rear J stock Bilsteins and they were underdamped on rebound. The back end was bouncy to the point making me seasick (and I don't get seasick.) They came off the car as soon as I got home. The VAC motorsports Konis I run (that are tuned by TC Klein) have very little compression damping, but the rebound is maxed out. The ride is firm, but controlled. Not overdamped either.

                              I dont' think these springs need more compression damping, but do need more rebound damping.

                              Will
                              '69 Datsun 2000 Roadster vintage race car (Street driven on a regular basis :taz
                              '59 Alfa Romeo 101 Sprint (HUGE project :uhoh
                              '88 M3

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