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Durability of aftermarket motor mounts

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  • MMMM
    replied
    Originally posted by jimmy p. View Post
    Fairly horrific.
    I have a pretty high tolerance for NVH, I used to drive a fully solid mounted GTO drag car and enjoyed it many years ago,,, but yeah, its about as bad as you would expect it to be with a buzzy 4 cylinder solidly bolted to a solid everything else car.

    Shit is constantly vibrating off.
    Loctite red and blue and Nylock nuts everywhere are my best friends.
    Quite literally if I cannot get a nylock nut on something, its got loctite on it because otherwise, it will fall off.
    This is why I opted for the Gr.N engine/transmission mounts. I have a dedicated track day car, not a proper race car (not yet anyway) so solid mounts imply problems in many other areas. Since installing these I have done 7 track days and +10.000Km so I think it is safe to say they work for my purpose better than any aftermarket option.

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  • e21jason
    replied
    the only thing is they are shorter than stock so my front sub-frame reinforcement makes up the height difference

    Jason

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  • kengarchow
    replied
    any other comments on the burtonpower.com mounts mentioned earlier in this post?
    thanks

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  • Ironhead
    replied
    Originally posted by Jake View Post
    ^ Jimmy is my effing hero. Probably the #1 E30 M3/S14 fan if there ever was one.

    Jake
    Yup....

    The mere thought of a solid mounted S14 scares me. I once tried a solid shift lever (no rubber insert) and it about drove me crazy in a mile.

    I would also worry about actual fatigue that would occur by all that vibration transfered directly to the chassis.
    Last edited by Ironhead; 02-16-2011, 07:08 PM.

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  • Jake
    replied
    ^ Jimmy is my effing hero. Probably the #1 E30 M3/S14 fan if there ever was one.

    Jake

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  • jimmy p.
    replied
    Originally posted by JS154 View Post
    Jimmy hows the noice and vibration with the solid mounts?
    Fairly horrific.
    I have a pretty high tolerance for NVH, I used to drive a fully solid mounted GTO drag car and enjoyed it many years ago,,, but yeah, its about as bad as you would expect it to be with a buzzy 4 cylinder solidly bolted to a solid everything else car.

    Shit is constantly vibrating off.
    Loctite red and blue and Nylock nuts everywhere are my best friends.
    Quite literally if I cannot get a nylock nut on something, its got loctite on it because otherwise, it will fall off.

    However,,, i wouldn't change a thing (for a dedicated race car).
    its so direct.
    Transition throttle is so much fun.
    I couldn't go back.
    I enjoy the benefits much more than I am annoyed by the downsides.

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  • JS154
    replied
    Jimmy hows the noice and vibration with the solid mounts?

    I suppose you could run solid mounts, and notch the trans crossbrace so that part fails first under high load, instead of the trans ears.

    That bracket would be easy-peasy to swap out.

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  • jimmy p.
    replied
    Originally posted by JS154 View Post
    That was my initial thought, but then think of it this way....

    I would rather have a sacrifical mount fail under impact stress like I mentioned, which I can swap out in 10 minutes in the paddock, versus having the ears on the tranny break off, or have the trans crossmember fail.
    Well,,, sadly,,, I'm pretty sure AKG didnt have that design intent of the sacrificial motor mount in mind when they made them, I think it was just bad design...

    However Eric,,, I think your statement has merit in that I would also rather replace a motor mount than a subframe at the track (or even periodically as a service item).

    I got so incredibly sick of replacing motor mounts at the track, I just went solid.

    I think the AKG could be the "next best" design to Grp N if they just had a deeper / better anchor into the delrin.
    Then in theory it could still sacrifice fail if needed in an impact, but not tear in half under aggressive service which is what happened.

    I bit the bullet og the Grp A replica arms,,, once again making both cars more similar by the day, nut by nut, bolt by bolt haha.

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  • JS154
    replied
    Originally posted by MMMM View Post
    I have not seen any evidence the BMW Motorsport Gr.N mounts break. They will eventually wear out but not break. There is a big difference in the potential damage it can cause ... The high initial price is offset by their longer life cycle. It is a well tested item over the course of +20 years of racing ...

    The only other valid option for track use are the Gr.A replica aluminum mounts Conrad is making. We had Gr.A magnesium mounts as well but decided to sell them.
    in an impact, even minor car to car - the Grp N mounts will break. I've seen it time and time again on other droivers cars that I refuse to spends the hundred$ of dollars when I can get a stiffer mount like AKG or Ireland for less.

    Keep spares in the track bin. simple.

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  • JS154
    replied
    Originally posted by jimmy p. View Post
    Wow,,,, I am shocked at the failure mode of the AKG mount.
    How the f*ck could they not expect that to fail.
    Thats a horrible design.
    So glad i didnt buy a set of those.


    Still cant believe the AKG mount has so little meat into the mount.
    Thats just designed to fail. Shame.
    That was my initial thought, but then think of it this way....

    I would rather have a sacrifical mount fail under impact stress like I mentioned, which I can swap out in 10 minutes in the paddock, versus having the ears on the tranny break off, or have the trans crossmember fail.

    Kinda the same reason the two-piece driveshaft makes sense - in a similar situation, it;s just going to slide apart, instead of a single piece design putting all sorts of stresses on guibos, diff and diff mounts and subframe mounts etc...

    all the stress has to go somewhere, best to sacrifice an easy to replace mount.

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  • kengarchow
    replied
    MMMM thanks, saw the photo but not the #'s, how about the transmission mount #

    so group n vs conrad's
    any clear choice
    is one or the other easier on the frame?
    thanks

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  • LeeVuong
    replied
    If anybody here wants to make engine mounts, I would gladly collaborate and submit ideas.

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  • jimmy p.
    replied
    Lee,
    Your ireland thread was the first thing I thought of when I saw that pic of the failed AKG mount.
    Amazing they just "re-made" the same mistake / design flaw

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  • MMMM
    replied
    Originally posted by kengarchow View Post
    while on the subject, can someone give me the part # for the group N motor and transmission mount please

    thanks
    You have it in the pictures I posted a couple of days ago. The p/n is engraved on the cup:

    11811417407 N
    Last edited by MMMM; 02-15-2011, 08:36 PM.

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  • MMMM
    replied
    Originally posted by JS154 View Post
    Gruppe N mounts are stupid expensive. And they will break just like a stock one too. But they are stupid expensive.
    I have not seen any evidence the BMW Motorsport Gr.N mounts break. They will eventually wear out but not break. There is a big difference in the potential damage it can cause ... The high initial price is offset by their longer life cycle. It is a well tested item over the course of +20 years of racing ...

    The only other valid option for track use are the Gr.A replica aluminum mounts Conrad is making. We had Gr.A magnesium mounts as well but decided to sell them.

    Leave a comment:

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