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Why do people pick the E30 M3 to do an engine swap?

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  • #16
    In defense of the swappers, I'd say...
    1, There is just nothing quite like big power in a small light package.
    2, It may be the challenge of the task. If successful, then the satisfaction is great.
    3, Some people may have already done the usual S14 mods and found that there is nothing else left to do. With the S14 more power is made by raising the revs.
    Go up in capacity and you start with more torque and if aBMW power plant, an engine that has more revs left in it to extract more power.
    Why climb the mountain?...'Cos it's there.

    Swaps are not restricted to the E30 M3. It is common for the 2002 and the Vanilla E30s.
    But If you're going to do it right, it is best to use the toughest chassis and one that can handle more power and possibly weight, so the E30 M3 is the best choice

    I did the hybrid swap stuff when I was into VWs, and I have a 1280 pound car that will put out close to 200hp, so I know what satisfaction can be derived from big motor , small car combos.
    I'm personally happy with my car stock.
    m

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    • #17
      Originally posted by rjd2
      So it seems your main concern is the value of your car? I think If you invested $15,000 into a fairly conservative fund for the next ten years you'd have a bit more money then holding on to that M3. Didn't we all buy these cars to enjoy? It would seem that we all have our own ideas about how best to enjoy these unique vehicles. It would be totally absurd to me to own a 12,500 miles bubble car but someone else might get a big smile on their face everytime they open the garage door and saw the thing sitting there. Good for them. I just can't understand getting so upset that you'd need to start a thread. I think I've added a new one..you can't talk religon, politics, and engine swaps in e30 M3's without someone getting pissed off.
      Amen!

      Look everyone, on a whole, automobiles do not make for good investments. Yes, the E30 M3 can appreciate but certain factors need to be present for you to observe the wonderful path to small fortunes you all make mentions to down the road. First, any enthusiast I know uses their car for its intended purpose, as such, the car loses value regularly. The only E30 M3's that will carry impressive prices are the ones being stored for their next owner.

      Even the bubble cars selling for $30K+ is an anomoly, it's the result of perfect timing and the randomness of a wealthy man's wallet being guided by a excitable youth.

      Consider that a perfect E30 M3 being sold by the original owner has cost the diligent owner well over 50,000+ for routine maintenance, gas, insurance, dealership looting:grr: So- even a 30,000 E30 is taking a significant long term loss!

      My point is two fold. First, the really unique E30 M3's which are living boring lives in garages will be worth ALOT someday, that does not mean everyone else gets to observe the same appreciation curve. Second, automobiles are NEVER be considered investments, they should be enjoyed for their intended purpose! Value and enjoyment do not go hand in hand.

      How many people did I tick off?

      Peace,
      T
      '91 318i "does it all"
      '91 Klein Rascal "eco-friendly"

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      • #18
        Just say no to swaps. I don't understand how the car is still special, distinct, or unique any longer without the s14. You buy a car for what is under the hood - not what you think you can wedge in there. The wedging mentality has ruined a lot of very nice classic american cars - and matching number cars are now worth a small fortune thanks to it.

        T

        and though i'd die hard about the s14 in this chasis - something about Tony's s54 swap does not bother me... it could be because he took an s14 about as far as it could go before trying something else - or it could be because the s54 is an amazing engine even for this technological age (Vastly more special than any of the e36 variant motors) and has a lot of the same character the s14 does. It'll be interesting to get his opinion on how the car is after that swap....
        1990 e30 m3

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        • #19
          Originally posted by rjd2
          So it seems your main concern is the value of your car?]

          No, not at all - but I don't go out and buy an Alfa Romeo. Maserati. Pontiac because I am not a Kamikazi pilot. Have BMW sales gone up more or less than Alfa or Maserati in the last 10, 20 years despite the free advertising in the Graduate?

          I think If you invested $15,000 into a fairly conservative fund for the next ten years you'd have a bit more money then holding on to that M3. Didn't we all buy these cars to enjoy? It would seem that we all have our own ideas about how best to enjoy these unique vehicles.
          Sure, take away from the fund the cost of having so much fun - fun costs, and your objective should be to maximise the fun, and minimise the cost surely

          It would be totally absurd to me to own a 12,500 miles bubble car but someone else might get a big smile on their face everytime they open the garage door and saw the thing sitting there.
          The smile may not be so big if he had put a chevvy engine in it or put a huge spoilers on the darn thing.

          Good for them. I just can't understand getting so upset that you'd need to start a thread. I think I've added a new one..you can't talk religon, politics, and engine swaps in e30 M3's without someone getting pissed off.
          Dangerous cocktail, for sure:p
          Evo Sport 1990
          M3 CSL 2003

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by UofOm3
            [B]Just say no to swaps. I don't understand how the car is still special, distinct, or unique any longer without the s14. You buy a car for what is under the hood - not what you think you can wedge in there. the wedging mentality has ruined a lot of very nice classic american cars - and matching number cars are now worth a small fortune thanks to it.

            Hear, hear
            Last edited by PPPP; 10-29-2005, 02:26 PM.
            Evo Sport 1990
            M3 CSL 2003

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by TYMl3S
              Amen!

              Look everyone, on a whole, automobiles do not make for good investments. Yes, the E30 M3 can appreciate but certain factors need to be present for you to observe the wonderful path to small fortunes you all make mentions to down the road. First, any enthusiast I know uses their car for its intended purpose, as such, the car loses value regularly. The only E30 M3's that will carry impressive prices are the ones being stored for their next owner.

              How many people did I tick off?
              Peace,
              T

              Well said - the certain factors you mention include some meaningful originality. You did not tick me off, I am pleased you took the trouble to participate
              Evo Sport 1990
              M3 CSL 2003

              Comment


              • #22
                The smile may not be so big if he had put a chevvy engine in it or put a huge spoilers on the darn thing.

                I don't know 350hp aluminum V8 in a 2800lbs car would always put a big smile on my face. And last time I checked the biggest most absurd, and completly awsome wing I've ever seen is a BMW part evo wing with DTM flap

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                • #23
                  Say no more...

                  Originally posted by Mmark
                  In defense of the swappers, I'd say...
                  1, There is just nothing quite like big power in a small light package.
                  Yuuuup...

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Say no more...

                    Originally posted by ///Mous3
                    Yuuuup...

                    But I did not give you permission to shoot yourself out of a cannon:surprised :p
                    m

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by UofOm3
                      Just say no to swaps. I don't understand how the car is still special, distinct, or unique any longer without the s14.
                      not that its neccesarily better...but im sure theres more E30 M3's with S14's, than engine swaps.. doesnt that = unique?

                      Originally posted by UofOm3
                      You buy a car for what is under the hood - not what you think you can wedge in there.
                      how can you present a statement like that as fact? maybe thats your opinion, but definetly not everyones. certain engines are put in cars by manufacturers for different reasons.. i dunno, you know your my bro, but you have a tendancy to always present your opinions as fact. the E30 M3 is but one of many car models, and we are but one of many car communities. just because you have these feelings/experiences with the E30 M3 doesnt mean that outlines what you should do for EVERY car ever made, i mean come on.
                      1990 M3/1998 M3 Sedan

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        We haven't discussed this enough .

                        Anyway, my whole take on engine swaps is a passive aggressive one. I don't begrudge anyone for doing it, I simply mutter to myself that they shouldn't have done it with my favorite car. This comes from the fact that I love the car for what it is, not what can or cannot be done to it. It has absolutely no bearing on whether or not the owner has a responsiblity to uphold the S14's place in the engine bay.

                        Personally, I don't put a whole lot of stock into the fact that these cars are going to be worth a whole bunch in 10, 20 years. There are better investments out there and for my money, the investments are never going to be in a car. As great as the E30 M3 is, and as an icon for BMW, the 80s, the DTM era, etc. it is not a 300SL or 250GTO. Perhaps I am wrong, but it leads me to my next point.

                        I like to drive the piss out of my car and I take care of it so I can. I plan on driving it, loving it, and caning it for as long as I am able to. If I had some notion of using it as a nest egg of some sort I'd store it, but then it would defeat the purpose of even owning it.

                        So, people can go ahead and do what they want to their E30 M3- whether or not they "get it"- as long as they are cognisant of the fact that their idea of ownership will not be identical to anyone else's.
                        1988 BMW M3
                        2010 Ferrari 599
                        2013 BMW X1

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by TYMl3S
                          Amen!

                          Look everyone, on a whole, automobiles do not make for good investments. Yes, the E30 M3 can appreciate but certain factors need to be present for you to observe the wonderful path to small fortunes you all make mentions to down the road. First, any enthusiast I know uses their car for its intended purpose, as such, the car loses value regularly. The only E30 M3's that will carry impressive prices are the ones being stored for their next owner.

                          Even the bubble cars selling for $30K+ is an anomoly, it's the result of perfect timing and the randomness of a wealthy man's wallet being guided by a excitable youth.

                          Consider that a perfect E30 M3 being sold by the original owner has cost the diligent owner well over 50,000+ for routine maintenance, gas, insurance, dealership looting:grr: So- even a 30,000 E30 is taking a significant long term loss!

                          My point is two fold. First, the really unique E30 M3's which are living boring lives in garages will be worth ALOT someday, that does not mean everyone else gets to observe the same appreciation curve. Second, automobiles are NEVER be considered investments, they should be enjoyed for their intended purpose! Value and enjoyment do not go hand in hand.

                          How many people did I tick off?

                          Peace,
                          T
                          What you said sounds good but not all true. Cars CAN be an investment depending on which ones we're talking about and as long as there is someone willing to pay the money for it. I think we can all agree that E30 M3's will always be sought after for one reason or another because it is a special car. Wouldn't you like to buy a decent M1 for say $30K if you had the means? or perhaps a 2002 turbo for 10K? Wouldn't you say that they would be good investments? Isn't this what Barrett Jackson is all about?

                          As far as only the MINT garage-queen cars appreciating in value, I disagree because as long as the car is straight, in (or close to) it's original configuration it'll still be valuable because they'll be harder and harder to find. Bolt ons and engine rebuilds are a little different than an entire engine/wiring/dme + etc etc swap. A motor swapped car can be restored but will be less desirable because who would want to deal with someone else's custom work? and they're not all done the same either.

                          88 M3 - LACHSSILBER/M TECH
                          89 M3 - ALPINEWEISS II/SCHWARZ
                          85 323I S52 - ALPINEWEISS/SCHWARZ
                          91 M TECHNIC TURBO - MACAOBLAU/M TECH


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                          • #28
                            Do some people miss the whole point of the E30 M3?

                            Or do I miss the point? This thread has NO intention of squashing the whole powerplant transplant idea but to me, atleast, it seems that people who transplant the S14 out of the the M3 miss the entire essence of what the car is/was! Why would anybody want anything other than the S14 inside that chassis? I don't know want to come off as a snob or purist but I have a real hard time accepting somebody as a 'real' E30 M3 enthusiast if their sole intent and/or general intent is to rip out it's heart that makes it what it is and replace it with anything else. The potential of the S14 is reason alone to leave it in, though understandably expensive...but is it possible to truly love the e30 M3 if you are so unhappy as to want to remove her heart and replace it with something/anything which IMO is inferior?

                            I don't know...I have just seen a lot of things lately in here and out of here that make(s) me question why people are attracted to this car. I know why I am attracted to it. Anyhow...just a random rant. You guys can go off and run with this now and tell me that I am a bad guy. :p

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                            • #29
                              Repost.
                              www.ubertechnik.com

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                There, there.
                                We're glad to see you came to us, just to get this off your chest.

                                Raise your tire pressures to 36F and 34R, and take the old M3 out for a little drive.

                                As long as you mind the wet leaves, you'll feel so much better.

                                it's gonna be alright:p
                                m (S14)

                                Oh, And check the oil level before you go out will ya?
                                Last edited by Mmark; 10-31-2005, 05:16 AM.

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