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My M3 build pics (pre turbo)

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  • #31
    Guess I've overlooked JE pistons even though I've delt with TEP before.

    Those JE's look to have great valve pockets compared to anything else I've seen offered besides John's Grp A pistons. Sure look better than weiscos or CPs from the pics i've collected of builds.
    Photos

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    • #32
      JE makes good stuff and now they etch the job# in each piston so if you blow them up & need to reorder you can... Always a plus.
      Rich!

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      • #33
        I know you want to try something different, but you are seriously wasting your hard earnt if you think a remote mounted will be anything other than a pig to drive. Ad to that the massively oversized turbo. Why try different. Try what actually works. Its like saying I am going to fit 20" rims and hope they are OK......they wont be.

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        • #34
          I like your "pioneer" spirit, Schwartzman, but I have to agree with Dave. It will take a lot of time and money to get the turbo up and running, more than you think. Trust me, you don't wanna have to redo it...
          Anders

          "Objects in mirror are losing..."

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          • #35
            I know, I know, Dave... have you ever have an idea that just burns the cuiosity in your head til it is etched in your brain? I gotta try it... I am hoping I can get it to fit at the end of the manifold next to the transmission, we'll see next week.

            The expense will be minimal to fit the turbo, since there is no manifold to make, just flange to flange and maybe a X or Ypipe and the aluminum piping to the intake will be so much that it can be reused to fabricate changes if I need to. It may be a pipe dream but my mechanic is doing the fabricating and labor for free since it was mostly his idea.

            The GT35R isn't that much larger than the GT30R I think the difference in spool in rpm is @800rpm, with the right cams and a few other trick I should be able to get it to spool on demand.
            Rich!

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            • #36
              A 'remote system' in turbo lingo generally refers to a system whereby the turbo is placed outside the engine compartment. The proposed setup isn't actually a remote system in the common context, but it is relatively far from the cyl head. It won't respond like a short, pulse-tuned turbo manifold, but it won't be as bad as a conventional remote system.

              A 35R isn't excessive for a 2.5L 4-cyl engine, but it won't exactly be snappy in traffic at moderate rpm with a common .63 A/R open T3. I'll need to get Schwartzman into a twinscroll setup before it's over . . .
              2003 Mitsu EVO VIII - 2.0L / 600+whp
              1988 BMW M3 turbo - Work in progress. . .
              1986 SVO Mustang - Work in progress. . .

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              • #37
                Oh, so you're not mounting it back by the trunk like your link to STS showed??
                Anders

                "Objects in mirror are losing..."

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Ted B View Post
                  A 35R isn't excessive for a 2.5L 4-cyl engine
                  Thats a bit subjective Ted. If he wants to win a dyno pissing comp, it will be fine. If he wants to keep pace with me on a tight twisting corners of a track, he wont get close. He will never see usable boost. Horses for courses. Dyno sheets mean sweet FA in the real world.

                  I will be happy to eat my words if proven wrong. Not by a dyno readout. Not be a mathmatical equation of a turbo map. But by the seat of the pants dyno on a street.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by OZM3 View Post
                    Thats a bit subjective Ted. If he wants to win a dyno pissing comp, it will be fine. If he wants to keep pace with me on a tight twisting corners of a track, he wont get close. He will never see usable boost. Horses for courses. Dyno sheets mean sweet FA in the real world.

                    I will be happy to eat my words if proven wrong. Not by a dyno readout. Not be a mathmatical equation of a turbo map. But by the seat of the pants dyno on a street.
                    Dave, I've been in 1.8L VW's with GT35R's boost at 2800 and pull 11.8 in the 1/4mi.

                    Anders my intent was to put it close but not in the engine bay... so technically "remote" but I will test fit it by Thanksgiving.

                    Ted, if you have a hookup on a .78 TS I'm in!
                    Rich!

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by OZM3 View Post
                      Thats a bit subjective Ted. If he wants to win a dyno pissing comp, it will be fine. If he wants to keep pace with me on a tight twisting corners of a track, he wont get close.
                      On a 2.0L, a regular 35R with open T3 .63 A/R turbine housing leaves something to be desired, and makes for mostly a drag-only car. Been there, done that.

                      Now, a 2.5L has 25% more displacement than that 2.0L, and spools that same turbo a bit quicker. As far as those tight twisting corners though, you are correct in your assessment, but a twinscroll setup should make up the difference there.

                      Just for the sake of perspective, a recent 2.3L 4G63 with 4088R (one step larger than a 35R) in twinscroll T4 (.96 A/R) delivered 40psi of boost by 4200rpm, and generated 753whp and 700+ ft/lbs with an 8k rpm shift point on Q16 and 154mph trap speeds in a 3000+lb Eclipse. That cannot be duplicated by a regular open turbine housing, and is pure unusable insanity from our 2wd perspective, but illustrates what is possible. A slightly smaller 35R with an appropriate twinscroll hotside will run like gangbusters with the same (or greater) displacement and pump fuel.

                      Originally posted by ///schwartzman View Post
                      Ted, if you have a hookup on a .78 TS I'm in!
                      That's easy, but I suggest we use at least a .84A/R, and preferrably a 1.06 for you where T3 twinscroll is concerned. But . . .

                      I'm trying a 1.06 A/R T4 TS with 35R on my 2.0L in a couple of weeks, so hold on for a first-hand experienced opinion in the matter. I'm thinking that may be the way to go - hopefully won't generate enough midrange torque to break the transmission, but will deliver more than enough high rpm power on pump fuel to demolish just about anything else on the road.
                      2003 Mitsu EVO VIII - 2.0L / 600+whp
                      1988 BMW M3 turbo - Work in progress. . .
                      1986 SVO Mustang - Work in progress. . .

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                      • #41
                        Ok, finally the motor is complete and I should be installing it in the next few days... I'll post pics soon. I'm still debating whether to reinstall the p/s pump and a/c or shed the excess weight and drag. Gotta clean the car and engine bay tomorrow
                        Rich!

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                        • #42
                          Whoo Hoo!!! It's alive, it's alive! Finally the mini sessions before and after work yielded a growl tonight, the motor started on the MegaSquirt standalone, will work on some tuning with Ara's help, and I'll try to post video by next week after the new radiator and thermostat are installed... Pics are forthcoming
                          Rich!

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                          • #43
                            congrats!
                            Dan

                            88 M3
                            Black on Black

                            San Diego, CA
                            USA

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                            • #44
                              It's been awhile since I've confessed "father..." So here's the update. I started driving the car a couple days a week since February... I've broken in the motor (using Brad Penn Green Break-In Oil, highest ZDDP content I could find) oil changes at 100, 500 & 1000 miles I'm at about 1900 miles no real problems still tuning the MegaSquirt. Compression seems good, but I did a leak down test because I noticed in March I was loosing oil. Leak down was @2%, so I steam cleaned the oil pans and found that the upper pan is leaking. Life happens and I have a new boss ridin' me like her little pony... so I haven't had time to play much.

                              After much thought and persuasion from my addiction support group here, (Ted B., Anders, Oz, Wld Tony, Jeremiah...) I decided against the remote mount turbo setup, opting for a low (incognito) mount where the a/c compressor was. "Hopefully this satisfies the turbo gods..."

                              I dropped the car off on 5/14 to my fabricator Gian of www.blinemotorsports.com as I learn to weld this summer. We figured that with a low mount turbo in the a/c compressor area, it would be best to fabricate a new motor mount arm to allow for more space to run the DP & WG dump-tube. So stage I of the turbo fabrication: motor mount and turbo manifold design is done, flange ends clamps, flex-pipe etc. are on order. Needless to say I am happy with the direction it's going but I wish it were finished already, but budget will only allow so much at one time.

                              Oh yeah, I installed the STACK gauge cluster for a simple, modern multi-functional look, I just can't get enough carbon fiber thanks again Keith! I'll take & post some updated pics this week
                              Last edited by ///schwartzman; 05-24-2009, 02:10 PM.
                              Rich!

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                              • #45
                                Great to hear things are progressing. Look forward to the next install!

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