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  • Turbo Talk ITT...

    Hey, help me out a bit here. Looking to start a little "think tank" on a future turbo build I'll be undertaking. Looking to start right around Dec/January so I'm doing a little research and looking for folks to shoot-down ideas I'm having. For example:

    1. I'd really like to ditch the ITB's for my turbo effort. I'd rather construct a simple aluminum intake manifold and run a single throttle body and save my OEM stuff.

    2. VIPEC seems like the preferred engine management system. Anyone tried VEMS?? I'd like plug and play if anyone has it. Sure, I can wire up my own stuff but when you are building a whole car you have to limit your time or you'll never get done!! I don't mind paying a few bucks more for a proven standalone with plug and play.....unless the stock harness/wires aren't worth it?? I sure don't want to butcher the stock harness.

    I promise I'll do my best to search...just thought I might get a few quick answers/opinions on the above first....

    Thanks for your time!!
    Don

  • #2
    There is no way to do a true plug and play setup for a turbo E30 M3. The closest you will come is having someone build you a custom engine harness that interfaces with the existing plugs, connectors, and chassis harness, but supports the additional sensors and wiring needed for a turbo car. While you're at it, you'll be better off if you get rid of the distributor and install dedicated crank and cam sensors. Figure $2K and up for the harness plus the cost of the ECU, plus the cost of tuning - and that doesn't even start in on the manifold, exhaust, intercooler, etc.

    If you're paying someone to do it for you instead of doing it yourself, pick a reputable vendor and a well known ECU. I think Vipec would be a good choice from what I know about it, but there are many, many options that would work.

    I personally run a Megasquirt now, if and when I upgrade the offerings from Pectel, Life Racing and Syvecs have me interested. Tremendously powerful, but not as user friendly and a narrower user-base.
    Last edited by Brendan; 07-06-2013, 05:47 AM.
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    Track Car Build | COM Sports Car Club

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    • #3
      Thanks for the response! I'm ok with fabrication/wiring. Just figured someone had a plug/play option perhaps...... Hopefully someone chimes in that's used VIPEC. Nice build btw!!!

      Don

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      • #4
        http://store.vacmotorsports.com/vac-...kit-p2623.aspx

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        • #5
          If you read the fine print, it's not a bolt on kit. They only allow install at VAC. And coming from VAC it's going to be expensive - not sure if the $$$ they're quoting is right, but add it to your cart and it comes in over $10K.

          Also, don't know this for sure, but my guess is that they are using the cast iron treadstone manifold, but if I were to go this route I'd want a custom tig welded manifold myself.
          Last edited by Brendan; 07-07-2013, 01:33 PM.
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          • #6
            I use a Vipec. Every harness that Neel makes from Apex Motorsports. It would be a simple thing for him to add the necessary boost items. I love my system and have had zero issues has I'm pretty sure everyone who has a Vipec that was tuned by Neel would say
            If you'd like pics shoot me your email or look under my threads

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            • #7
              Sorry I meant to say that every harness made by Neel is custom

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              • #8
                Originally posted by erik bernstein View Post
                I use a Vipec. Every harness that Neel makes from Apex Motorsports. It would be a simple thing for him to add the necessary boost items. I love my system and have had zero issues has I'm pretty sure everyone who has a Vipec that was tuned by Neel would say
                If you'd like pics shoot me your email or look under my threads
                I'll check your thread out...been reading them little by little. Yes, read about Neel and Apex for sure. Definitely sounds like a viable option. I'm not concerned with adding a crank/cam sensor or adding wiring to support them...I just don't want to sacrifice the stock harness to do so. Thanks for the help.

                Don

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Brendan View Post
                  If you read the fine print, it's not a bolt on kit. They only allow install at VAC. And coming from VAC it's going to be expensive - not sure if the $$$ they're quoting is right, but add it to your cart and it comes in over $10K.

                  Also, don't know this for sure, but my guess is that they are using the cast iron treadstone manifold, but if I were to go this route I'd want a custom tig welded manifold myself.
                  Yes, saw that too on the VAC website. And I'm going the exact route you described...making my own stainless manifold but I'll be keeping it simple. It will be log-style since I'm not looking to eek out every drop of HP on this build by using equal length runners. It will definitely be bottom mount as well.

                  Wish I could start on this tomorrow...but I just don't have the time at the moment.

                  Thanks for the help/discussion!!

                  Don

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                  • #10
                    I removed the stock harness from the engine bay. No damage was done to it

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by dcvee View Post
                      I just don't want to sacrifice the stock harness to do so. Thanks for the help.
                      Originally posted by erik bernstein View Post
                      I removed the stock harness from the engine bay. No damage was done to it
                      You will need to remove and replace the stock engine harness. Erik's right - done right, it doesn't need to be damaged and your replacement custom harness can integrate with the chassis harness.
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                      • #12
                        So, remove the stock harness. Check. Ok. I'm checking out air metering options next. Map, Maf...I'm sure you guys don't use the AFM?? Searching continues...

                        Again, thanks for the help!!
                        Don

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                        • #13
                          Map
                          Last edited by Brendan; 07-08-2013, 01:17 PM.
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                          • #14
                            Use a MAP sensor as mentioned. You will probably want to use a standalone that will let you run Alpha-N near idle and cross over to speed density above that point. Most can do this, but its something to keep in mind.

                            Interested to see what you do with an S14 Don.
                            -Nick

                            1991 E30 with the "other" 16v 4cyl

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                            • #15
                              You could simplify the process and remove the butterflies in the ITB's and adapt a 90mm Ford Mustang T-body to the stock plenum... Just an idea, as costs can get out of hand quite quickly.

                              Undoubtedly the ViPEC V88 & harness from Neel @APEX has the best, tried & true setup for the S14. If I can offer any advice from my experience don't take a shortcut here... Neel has been helpful to me and I haven't even bought his system... Basically because he has an 8-12 week lead time, just accept his timeline you won't be disappointed.
                              Or...
                              Research the tuners in your area and what they are adept at tuning. I also suggest using a shop that uses a DynaPack to tune. Due to the proliferation of Hondas and Toyota/Scion's, the AEM EMS-4 has emerged as a very affordable option that a mass of tuners WILL tune vs DIY type kits like VEMS or MegaSquirt which most won't. My understanding is MoTEC has reduced their usual astronomical prices on their entry level EMS like the M-400 in the last season.

                              Forced induction is definitely an undertaking, and most take the easier S54 swap route but in the end... That's all they'll be seeing, rear-end. Good luck!
                              Rich!

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